Nemesis Registered User
Posts: 14
(7/29/05 9:03 am)
Re: Jasner reported
Quote:My only fear is that if he actually doesn't improve, and the Sixers can't trade him for fair value because the excuse that it was the coach who was holding him back won't be there now...
Two words; Kwame Brown. Seems big men aren't always held to the same standard as other positions - and personal failure doesn't always equal lack of interest from other GM's. Even if Sam doesn't improve immensely, there will always be teams like the Knicks, etc. that are in need of size.
Nemesis
"Almost forgot, he gave me a thousand dollars...I think his idea was that I'd kill you. But you know the pity is, when I'm paid I always follow my job through" - The "Bad"
Re: Jasner reported
Actually I completely disagree. Kwame essentially got the second contract that Sam got, only with another team. Kwame got traded to LA because of his potential. If he fails in LA,.his contract is only a two year contract, noone will care. In other words, if he's a bust (for the money he makes), he's not going to get paid that much again.
Sam however is under a 6 year contract. If he proves to be a bust, noone will trade you value for him. I've advocated that noone is untradeable in this league, and I stand by it, however what you get back is what's the problem. If Sam doesn't live up to his contract, trading him will be hard and if it happens, it will likely return also something of low value.
Remember Calvin Booth? He got a fat contract a few years ago...he's an athletic big man. I don't see teams lined up for him...
There are always big men who can jump and rebound and perhaps block a shot or two, but few of them have what it takes to win. Zendon Hamilton for instance could do that, but it doesn't mean he should be paid 8-10 million a year, right?
Theo
Nemesis Registered User
Posts: 15
(7/29/05 11:20 am)
Re: Jasner reported
Quote:There are always big men who can jump and rebound but few of them have what it takes to win.
Theo,
How many big men out there do have what it takes to win? The only ones I can think of in recent history are Shaq and Duncan - one, a physical exception and the other, a fundamentals exception. Ben Wallace is a beast defensively but do you think he'd be wearing a ring right now had LB not taken over in Detriot? Yao was hyped to death when he came into the league and though he's exceptional, do you think he has what it takes to win? Perhaps but he hasn't proved it yet. Kwame went #1 and Darko was right up there as well and where are they now? Darko's basically the laughing stock of Detriot and Kwame turned into the Wizards black sheep. Curry unfortunately has heart issues but even he has underachieved in Chicago IMO. Sam was what, 29th in the draft and yet I would bet that he put forth an effort better than most would have against Detriot. Now one playoff series does not make a player but if he can duplicate similar play in the regular season, getting him at 58 mil for 6 years will be a steal IMO. So with that, I would hope to see him average; 12+ ppg, 10+ rpg, and 2+ bpg.
Regardless, I wouldn't worry too much about Sam. At least not yet. Yes, he makes bone-headed mistakes but I think he's athletically more gifted than Kwame. Kwame looks the part but doesn't seem to have the quickness that Sam has nor the intensity. Of course, it's often this same over-eagerness that harnesses Sam with fouls. But these fouls are fouls that emerge due to effort. That alone, is a good sign because it means he's out there hustling, though not always intelligently. But IMO, Sam's major issues are confidence and BB IQ. I think Mo will instill in him the confidence he needs - if his contract #'s and playoff experience haven't done this already. I also think that Sam will cut down on mistakes playing in a system that's more suited for his talents. Anyway, we shall see...
Nemesis
"Almost forgot, he gave me a thousand dollars...I think his idea was that I'd kill you. But you know the pity is, when I'm paid I always follow my job through" - The "Bad"
Re: Jasner reported
I don't think you understand what I am saying...
I don't compare Sam to Kwame or whoever. I am simply stating that Sam, at that much money and years, HAS to play like Ben Wallace, HAS to play like a young Deke, HAS to play like Theo Ratliff when he was a Sixer. In other words, the contract puts expectations on him. What he has shown so far is flashes.
In other words, I am not saying if he''s good when compared to the other youngsters, I am saying that he HAS to be as good as the good ones now. If he doesn't produce, his trade value will degrade extremely fast, and , my main argument which you probably didn't understand, is that even if he's a big man, he still will be making more money than what he brings to the table, and you can find alternatives at much much cheaper price than what Sam makes. Hence GMs won't line up for him because he's a big man.
Take Stephen Hunter for instance. He's a big guy, who's athletic and can run and jump. However, he's not getting Sam money. If say he's signed at 4 million per year, in two years, if both Sam and Stephen are playing as they are playing today, everyone would prefer Hunter over Dalembert due to contract.
Theo
Nemesis Registered User
Posts: 16
(7/29/05 12:07 pm)
Re
Agreed. He HAS to do a lot of things next season. Management has showed him that they are serious about him by firing OBrien and forking over coin. I would hope that Sam gives them the same respect.
Nemesis
Sundown Registered User
Posts: 1538
(7/29/05 12:26 pm)
Re: Re
Wherever Carch is (who knows? It's like one the great mysteries ever!) he must be channeling through this "Nemesis" fella. Maybe they're long lost cousins?
littlebulldog Registered User
Posts: 2266
(7/29/05 12:49 pm)
Re: Re
Nemesis Registered User
Posts: 17
(7/29/05 12:50 pm)
Re: Re
Quote:Wherever Carch is (who knows? It's like one the great mysteries ever!) he must be channeling through this "Nemesis" fella. Maybe they're long lost cousins?
I agree with Theo. He just got me caught up when he said "few have what it takes to win" because I don't think any one Center (other than Shaq in his prime) can put his team over the edge. If a championship ultimately represents "winning", I'd say most 5's in this league don't have what it takes. I think it's a collective effort combined with great coaching. Look at Mutumbo in Atlanta for all those years before he came to the Sixers for example. As for Carch, do you blame him for disappearing? He'd have said half of what I and altec, and Mista wrote about Sam before being stoned to death on this board.
Nemesis
"Almost forgot, he gave me a thousand dollars...I think his idea was that I'd kill you. But you know the pity is, when I'm paid I always follow my job through" - The "Bad"
Sundown Registered User
Posts: 1539
(7/29/05 1:07 pm)
Re: What...Me Paranoid?!?
Quote:Is it possible that Carch is really back, but hiding out in drag?
Well, coming back as a woman would certainly make the infatuation with Sam slightly less creepy.
Although only slightly.
littlebulldog Registered User
Posts: 2267
(7/29/05 1:18 pm)
Re: What...Me Paranoid?!?
Quote:He'd have said half of what I and altec, and Mista wrote about Sam before being stoned to death on this board.
Funny. In a thread below, I recall them saying some of that same stuff and, oddly, nobody got 'stoned' or even got into an argument. It was actually wonderfully civil.
ChuckS Registered User
Posts: 286
(7/29/05 1:28 pm)
The play's the thing...
**** " And if you want to get deeper, "Chuck" is a derivative of "Chucky", a rat that's featured on the signs of Chucky Cheese!" ****
Aha...gotcha!!!! ...no doubt now.
Nemesis Registered User
Posts: 19
(7/29/05 1:33 pm)
Chuck
I do give you accolades on your research but I hate to disappoint you. I am not the notorious "Carch".
Nemesis
ChuckS Registered User
Posts: 287
(7/29/05 1:51 pm)
A rose by any other name...
Nemesis;
Wow, if that's true I feel much better! It would just mean that there are two of "you".
Only kidding!
Actually I've enjoyed your posts. Most have been neither aggressive or hostile.
And I apologize to the rest of the board. I just love Shakespeare and Greek Mythology.
what's wrong with Shakespeare, and most importantly, what's wrong with Greek Mythology?
No need to apologize for that! I've spent a good amount of my childhood reading those things, if I should feel sorry for that too, then my entire life is an excuse for a sorry!
Theo
jemagee Registered User
Posts: 344
(7/29/05 2:36 pm)
Re: A rose by any other name...
Nothing wrong with Greek Mytholog Theo
Just, you know, Norse Mythology is much much cooler, so is Egyptian
Yeah34 Registered User
Posts: 3433
(7/29/05 5:32 pm)
Maaaaaaannn...
I was wondering when someone else was going to figure out who Nemesis was. A "new" poster has the long standing knowledge about Altec and Carch? Oh yeah, that's believable. Let's not forget Carch was/is so unbelievably egotistical that he fancies himself a worthy "nemesis" to so many on the board. :
Jem, I've never been banned, but I do know that you can read the board as various things on different browsers. For example, you can have your cookies to always log you in on Firefox and read the board as a guest on Microsoft's Internet Explorer.
rulebook Registered User
Posts: 70
(7/29/05 5:37 pm)
naaaaahhhh
unless Carch is doing a great job at masking his writing style, Nemesis aint Carch.
Plus, we all know Carch was banned. Why would he come back incognito? It would hamstring posts to no end.
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